Talk:Subtle body

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SUBTLE ENERGY

Subtle takes it's origin from the French word sutil and it from the Latin word subtilis which is derived from the two Latin words sub (beneath)+ tela (weaving) with an underlying idea of "finely woven" (Encarta,2001) & (Bohm, 1990:271). Dictionaries describe it as "difficult to detect or grasp by the mind" and "Faint and difficult to analyze".

Energy [1] from a scientific perspective is the ability to do work. It is the force that moves things, including atoms, molecules, cellular processes, consciousness, and bodies of all shape and sizes, from plants to fingers (Pearsall, 1998:40).

According to conventional physics, there are only four kinds of energy (forces) in existence: electromagnetic-, gravity-, and two subatomic forces called the strong- and the weak force. (Gribbon,1998:57) Yet, consistent with the worldviews of indigenous cultures, the human body appears to be a multidimensional reality (Gerber, 2000:10), one in which humans experience a whole spectrum of energies, some from the physical dimension and some from the yet unknown (Collinge, 1998:16).

Energy forces beyond that which science could conclusively validate, might best be grouped into a category called 'subtle energies' [2](Tiller 1999). Also the 'Fifth Force' (Pearsal, 1998;38)[3]. For now, subtle energies can be defined as all those energies beyond those presently acknowledged in physics (Tiller 1993;34; Pert,1997;252).

Seaward as quoted in Pert (1997: 307) on the question on what he perceives subtle energy to be:

"I believe subtle energy is a kind of universal life force that flows through us from the divine. According to Eastern wisdom, everyone has an aura, a field of this energy surrounding the physical body, and flowing through it as well, travelling along lines called meridians by the Chinese or radiating out from the seven body centres called chakras by the practitioners of yoga. Westerners even have a version of it in Christianity, as a halo surrounding the crown of the head, often depicted on saints and angels in medieval art. But you don't have to be a saint, an angel, or yogi to acknowledge this subtle energy. It's in everyone and can be force for healing."

Larry Dossey (1997) on his perception of subtle energies:

"It may turn out that some form of energy may indeed be discovered in the future. Because this can't be ruled out, we are justified in using the term "subtle energy" in a provisional, qualified, metaphorical way. But as far as I can tell, almost nobody who speaks about "subtle energy" believes it is a metaphor, and they don't use it provisionally. They imply that it real, that it has already been demonstrated, and that it is a concrete reality."

References: (In sequence of usage)

BOHM, D. (1990). A New Theory of the Relationship of Mind and Matter, Philosphical Psychology, 3(2) p. 271.

PEARSALL, P. (1998). The Hearts Code. London: Harper Collins.

GRIBBON, J. (1998). Almost Everyone's guide to Science. London: Weidenfeld & Nicolson.

GERBER, R. (2000). Vibrational Medicine for the 21st Century. London: Judy Piatkus.

COLLINGE, W. (1998). Subtle energy - Understanding the Life Force Energies that surrounds us. New York: Warner Books.

TILLER, W. (1999). Subtle Energy. Science & Medicine, 6(3).

TILLER, W. (1993). What are Subtle Energies? Journal of Scientific Exploration, 7(3) p. 293-304.

DOSSEY, L. (1997). The Forces of Healing, Keynote address presented at the Second Annual Alternative Therapies Symposium; April 1997, Orlando, Florida. Retrieved April 26, 2002, from: http://twm.co.nz/dosseyl.html

--Louispalm 09:55, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Louispalm. As it is, it still reads too much like a short (although still very informative!) essay, with long quotes, rather than a wiki page. I think this should go on a separate / new wikipage. So either the quoted material should be paraphrased, or else it should be included in a separate "quotes" section at the bottom of the page. I like the fact that you have a lot of references; that's good!

btw Google Scholar returned 786 hits, and Google Book Search 3300, for "subtle energy", so it's certainly notable! M Alan Kazlev 10:06, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Removed Perispirit link as it is not relevant to this particular section, much less a 'Main article'. Knowledge for All 06:56, 13 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

table

The Ascending Constitution of the Being as described by Samael Aun Weor
Dimension	Lunar (Egoic) Vehicle	Solar (Christic) Vehicle	Sefirah
1st - 3rd	Physical body	Body of Liberation; Rainbow Body	Malkuth
4th	Ethereal Body; Vital Body	Body of Liberation; Rainbow Body	Yesod
5th	Lunar Astral Body; Desire Body; Kama rupa	Solar Astral Body	Hod
5th	Lunar Mental Body	Solar Mental Body; Inferior Manas	Netzach
6th	Essence; Virginal Spark	Solar Casual Body; Superior Manas; Human Soul	Tiphereth
6th	n/a	Buddhi; Divine Soul	Geburah
6th	n/a	Atman; The Innermost	Chesed
7th	n/a	The Holy Spirit; The Holy Reconciliation; Nirmanakaya	Binah
7th	n/a	Son; The Holy Negation; Sambhogakaya	Chokmah
7th	n/a	Father; The Holy Affirmation; Dharmakaya	Kether

From Mother Meera's site

[4]

"Mother Meera does not belong to any particular tradition, except for a certain closeness to the work of Sri Aurobindo and the Mother,^[1] whom she had allegedly met in their subtle bodies, when she was a child, visiting their Samadhi (grave).^[2]

Mother Meera

Austerlitz -- 88.75.202.92 (talk) 10:19, 23 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ See 'Sri Aurobindo Research Academy' in Mother Meera, "Answers, Part II", pages 189 - 195
^ Adilakshmi, "The Mother", pages 10 - 12

Removal of devotee-published sources

I have removed the reference to Kalchuri, Meher Prabhu. For discussion, see RS/N and this Talk page. Simon Kidd (talk) 07:57, 7 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

There is nothing in the RSN page you link to that gives you the right to remove referenced text. You are removing valid information from articles acting against consensus. Hoverfish Talk 20:33, 7 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I linked to two pages. Fifelfoo said on his Talk page: "I'd suggest editing out OR and inappropriately sourced content, citing policy and appropriate discussions, and discussing at length on the talk page." The relevant policy/guideline says that an article "must be based upon reliable third-party sources, and meets this requirement if [among other things, it] is independent and unaffiliated with the subject, thus excluding sources such as self-published material by the subject, autobiographies, and promotional materials". Kalchuri fails this test, since he is published by an organisation affiliated with the subject. Simon Kidd (talk) 23:02, 7 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You can't unilaterally decide that Lord Meher is not a reliable source. You can't unilaterally decide that it is devotional and not a reliable biography. What is "Devotional"? and who decides. Not You, Mr Kidd. Hoverfish Talk 16:24, 8 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Lead

I did a quick copyedit to the lead. The article makes it very clear that it's talking about a subject that's specified as part of particular belief systems, so IMO there's no need for any scientific perspective (and I doubt you'd find any). - LuckyLouie (talk) 22:03, 26 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Possible copyright problem

This article has been revised as part of a large-scale clean-up project of multiple article copyright infringement. (See the investigation subpage) Earlier text must not be restored, unless it can be verified to be free of infringement. For legal reasons, Wikipedia cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions must be deleted. Contributors may use sources as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously. IRWolfie- (talk) 22:08, 26 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I am referring to the material removed here: [5]. Do not restore it unless you are positive it contains no copyright violations. IRWolfie- (talk) 22:08, 26 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Suggesting an External Link

I'd like to suggest my website : http://energy-bodies.org/ as an additional external link, as I think my site provides the most correct and complete details of "subtle bodies". MasterChris Org (talk) 21:57, 11 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

No, sorrry. It's not a reliable source. IRWolfie- (talk) 22:59, 11 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Pyscho spiritual is transpersonal therapy and holistic counselling term

This term is not appropriate to use in this article as it doesn’t apply to the the subtle bodies described here but to a modern understanding in some forms of psychology that mental illness may arise from combination of mental, spiritual and physical aspects. So I’ve copy edited the article accordingly. Dakinijones (talk) 23:53, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

[1] See 'Sri Aurobindo Research Academy' in Mother Meera, "Answers, Part II", pages 189 - 195

[2] Adilakshmi, "The Mother", pages 10 - 12

[1]

[2]