Talk:Pyotr Stolypin

Assassination Section Plagiarism

I have a strong suspicion that the assassination section has copied text almost word for word from Orlando Figes' book on the Russian revolution "A People's Tragedy". I've read this book and recognise the phrasing. I no longer have a copy of it to check what parts are breaching wikipedia standards, but if anyone has a copy then could they change it? It would be a shame to have to rewrite the entire section. Blankfrackis (talk) 17:14, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

Leftist

"Leftist terrorist groups" should be changed to "leftist organizations." Whether they were actually committing terrorist acts is tenuous at best and under no circumstances is such a claim NPOV. - ?

Assassinations were facts and "terror" was the word, borrowed from French Revolution, not from George W. Bush. Mikkalai 07:55, 5 Aug 2004 (UTC)

You say - "the phrase is specifically about groups who performed assassinations, "terror" is from their vocabulary,and they were terrorists by fact, not by POV". I think it's pretty obvious that the word "terrorist groups" in the context that it's used in the article insinuates that ALL the organizations of the era which were battling against the Russian monarchy used terrorist tactics, which is quite simply not true. The vast majority used strikes - or more generally, urged insurrection - which is not a "terrorist tactic". To suggest that even a small fraction of the organizations of the time were utilizing assassinations to accomplish their goals would be patently ridiculous. It is also quite fallacious to suggest that the tactics used by organizations that had support as widespread as the Russian progressives could utilize "terror" in the same sense that Robespierre prescribed it - the former used it (very rarely) to attempt to establish a popular leftist regime, whereas the latter used it to coerce the populace into subservience. The motives (and the origins) are completely different, which is why the use of the word "terrorist groups" cannot be considered as anything other than utterly biased and not at all NPOV. - ?

But, if he was using the word terrorism, then its alright. besides, some people who believed they were terrorists might think that saying "leftist organizations" would not be NPOV. it would be on the side of the terrorists. In the future, please sign your name--Bagel7 02:37, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

Many leftist organisations of the time e.g. the Populists, Socialist-Revolutionaries etc. were directly involved in political assassinations of government officials, members of the royal family etc. This counts as terrorism by any normal definition. Certainly there were some leftist groups such as the Mensheviks who were involved in peaceful strikes rather than terrorism, but they were not the main target of Stolypin's law-and-order measures. The term "leftist terrorist groups" is perfectly accurate. Walton monarchist89 09:16, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

The word "organisation" doesn't imply anything which would breach NPOV standards. It's a neutral word, calling Al-Qaeda an "organisation" doesn't say anything about whether it's a terrorist group. Calling them "freedom fighters" would breach NPOV standards but not "organisations". Blankfrackis (talk) 01:12, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

Rasputin and St. Petersburg

In 1911 he ordered Rasputin out of St. Petersburg, and was obeyed. this was followed by an investigation by Lukyanov, minister of religion. The empress wasn't very fond of him after this point. And continued to support Rasputin.

Rasputin also prophesied his death the day previously.

The fall of the Russian Monarchy Pares 1939 Sethwoodworth 01:36, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Is this really correct?

Was Stolypin really interior minister "under Ivan Goremykin" (section: Governor and Interior Minister) and in office 1904-1905 (according to the succession box)? If the latter is correct, shouldn't be "under Sergei Witte" who was Chairman of the Committee of Ministers 1903-1905. But according to List of Ministers of Interior of Imperial Russia Stolypin was Ministers of Interior 1906-1911 and preceeded by Pyotr Nikolayevich Durnovo. About Durnovo you can read that he was Minister of interior 1905-1906 and succeeded by Stolypin. My conclusion is that Stolypin was both Prime minister and Minister of Interior 1906-1911, thus not "under Ivan Goremykin". Correct?--79.138.209.66 (talk) 22:25, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

He served under Gorymkin from April to July 1906. john k (talk) 14:47, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Was Stolypin really a keen taxidermist - can someone verify this?? - No reference in the article —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andrewbiden (talk • contribs) 18:36, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

Bias

Some of this page reads like a cheerleader. "Maliciously misrepresented"? "grossly misleading"? I think maybe it should be cleaned up by someone with more of an interest in conveying the facts about Stolypin, rather than trying to rehabilitate his reputation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.130.39.203 (talk) 02:01, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Date of Death

The information box conflicts with what is said in the second-to-last section which claims he died on Sep. 14. According to the Encyclopedia Britannica, Stolypin died on the 18th. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vopz (talk • contribs) 01:38, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

Possible Vandalism?

I'm no expert on this period, but I found suspect the suggestion that Stolypin used castration to keep the peasantry in line. There is no mention of this in the only source provided for this part of the text. Anyone help here?

Separately, the allegations that his daughters pushed their brother off a bridge also raised questions? Nandt1 (talk) 00:22, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

Reviewing the article's history, these unsourced claims (and a few more, such as his having allegedly trained with the ballet but withdrawn after injuries) were all inserted during a brief editing bout by an unregistered editor with no other history on Wikipedia. I feel justified in treating them as overwhelmingly likely to have been vandalism pure and simple. If any user wishes to provide reliable sources to back up any of these claims, please be my guest! Nandt1 (talk) 16:26, 26 November 2013 (UTC)

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Birthplace

Stolypin seems to have been born in Dresden on 14 April 1862, and was later baptized on 24 May in the Russian Orthodox Church in the same city.

– The puzzling formulation "seems to have been" only raises questions, and the absence of any explanation as to why he was born in Germany raises more questions.

I don't really read Russian, but I know enough to see that the Russian Wikipedia article states flatly that he was born in Дрезден, Саксония (Dresden, Saxony). Further, the German Wiki article notes, Sein Vater, General Arkadi Dmitrijewitsch Stolypin (1821–1899), war zeitweise als russischer Gesandter in Deutschland tätig; so wurde Stolypin in Dresden geboren ("His father, General Arkady Dimitrievich Stolypin (1821-1899), was at the time a Russian envoy [representative] in Germany; thus, Stolypin was born in Dresden.")

I've edited the sentence above to incorporate this information. Sca (talk) 21:35, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

Huh?

Stolypin was shot twice, once in the arm and once in the chest by Dmitry Bogrov, a leftist revolutionary, trying to rehabilitate himself.

– Really? In Russia one rehabilitates oneself by killing high-ranking government officials? Clause deleted. Sca (talk) 21:45, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

Screen portrayal

I have added a new section on Screen portrayals, kicking off with Eric Porter's appearance as Stolypin in the British film Nicholas and Alexandra. I am allowing and encouraging the addition of any other portrayals that may have been in films produced by other countries and possibly by actors who may be better known.

Legacy Section Plagiarism

Almost all of the third paragraph in the Legacy section (beginning "There remains doubt, however") is lifted from Michael Lynch's "Reaction and Revolution: Russia 1894-1924" (the section of the book is "Difficulties confronting Stolypin", which in my 4th edition book is pages 47-49). Minor phrasing and order have been changed, but is verbatim the same except for that. (Sentences the same or only one word from the text include: "The deep conservatism from the mass of peasants made them slow to respond" and "Most peasants were unwilling to leave the security of the commune for the uncertainty of individual farming"). I do not know exactly what rewrites would have to be done, hopefully this catches the eye of someone more versed in these things. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.237.247.169 (talk) 20:07, 6 April 2024 (UTC)

Confusing Wording - Interior Minister and Prime Minister

In the section titled "Interior Minister and Prime Minister" there are a few (IMO) poorly-worded sentences and vague pronoun usage, leading to ambiguity as to the sentences' meaning.

"When Goremykin resigned on 21 July [O.S. 8 July] 1906, Nicholas II appointed Stolypin as Prime Minister, while remaining as Minister of the Interior. He dissolved the Duma, despite the reluctance of some of its more radical members, to clear the field for cooperation with the new government."

The way this passage is worded leaves it up to the reader to guess WHO the Minister of the Interior is (Nicholas? as it would seem to imply in the sentence structure, but that can't be the case, as earlier in the section it notes that Stolypin was appointed interior minister [not the same formal title?] under Prime Minister Goremykin) as well as WHO dissolved the Duma ('He' here as a pronoun is ambiguous, as though the immediate preceding person mentioned is Nicholas, it's fairly clear that the actual "Minister of the Interior" is talking about Stolypin - so, presumably, Stolypin dissolved the Duma. Maybe.).

I'm not really familiar with the Wikipedia editing standards, but I did feel the need to point this issue out. I'll leave the proper editing work to the valuable editors and community. Cheers :) 68.204.249.175 (talk) 23:58, 12 August 2024 (UTC)